Day Camping Anyone?
By nighthawk • May 21st, 2008 • Category: Opinions and Editorials(Local Campground Closes At 9PM)
The picture speaks for itself.
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May 24th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
May 24th, 2008 at 6:02 pm
May 24th, 2008 at 8:53 pm
nighthawk…i think…THINK…it should work now. i’m going to log out and try it as a random poster and see what happens.
May 24th, 2008 at 8:54 pm
please oh please work
May 24th, 2008 at 8:55 pm
trying again…
May 24th, 2008 at 8:56 pm
bingo! we have a winner
the tags listed above this comment box can now be used insert code into your comments.
May 24th, 2008 at 9:08 pm
Thanks for the work Dave! Looking better! Have a great weekend!
May 29th, 2008 at 3:43 pm
You posted this picture of Rodburn Park and it was in the hands/management of the USDA USFS for a long time, BUT a State Rep I met said he got nutton but the runaround when he went bouncing from one office to another around Frankfort asking about the required state legislative permission granted to the Feds for ownership of land, in his case designated part of the Jefferson National Forrest over near Louisville. The interest in this came from the restricted use provisions that some of his constituents, (and peers) had found themselves under for being in a "buffer zone" near a biosphere around Mamouth Cave, and Land between the Lakes. The "paranoia" was generated by these lands being designated "UN man and the biosphere" sites and other Clinton era efforts like the Heritage Rivers "initiative" where rivers could be nominated by a president or a group of people (NGO-non-governmental organizations). The EPAII (c.1992) law as the media called it also provided that the driveway and garage of a "residence" was public access and no warrent was required to search and seize and crush any "vehicle" that had dropped oil in the watershed. Now, the economy is eliminating old cars to be crushed for the scrap price and because parts are becoming scarce as more older cars get crushed. The "EPA2" law may not need to be enforced BUT it is still on the books waiting for a policy change? Every 5 years a new set of cars is set to be phased out and no title renewal. Right now, I think all cars older than 1997 are to be crushed if they can’t pass emmisssion standards after a 6month chance to repair and those older than 1992 are not to be retitled. As far as I have heard none of this has been rescinded.
Now how does this pertain to Rodburn Park? Well IFFFFF there was never any legit holdership for USDA USFS then the transfer to MOREHEAD, inc. is invalid and anyone charged with a KRS statute violation for being there after dark or camping should
consider a fight based on that technicality. (Besides that auto parts store "MOREHEAD, Inc.
of North Carolina?)
The Organic Constitution provides that the FED cannot purchase or occupy land in a boundary of a state without that state’s express legislative permission. No legislative record is said to exist SO the possession/management of such land is not lawful.
(they could argue adverse possession by abandonment of locals having discharged payments in lue of property taxes for "x" number of years but this reeks of violation of bothe the letter and spirit of the law and for any associated sworn officials, it would constitute a prima facia oath of office violation, but alas, no black robed one will likely hear such arguments without a dream team and a bunch of media exposure, then there is the off ramps of "in the interest of justice" or the proverbial "mountain demurrer" that causes stuff to disappear off the court docket?
May 29th, 2008 at 7:53 pm
The sign in the picture conflicts with the long standing rule;
"Recreation Area CLOSED after Dark to Public except campers"
A Forestry Road marker (13C) Is still posted on the left spur road around the campsites. Affixed to that marker is a sticker citing that it is a FELONY to remove the sign…
But nevertheless the sign is behind the Green and White Sign in the picture.
The road (13C) does serve as a route to the Martin Branch Trail which is the most logical access to the Sheltowee Trace National Recreation Trail.
So how are we to know the sign in the picture isn’t a Boss-Hog/Roscoe type of tactic to cite back country hikers who journey into the campgrounds from the woodlands after hours?
And do we not have the right to travel?
Would… no more like… Could any jury be led to believe that traveling through the park (via 13C) in order to gain access to The Martin Branch Trail (spur of the Sheltowee Trace) after 9:PM is an actual violation of the law? Posted or Not.
The adverse possession argument could be used in a number of ways…
For Example;
This land has been used by the people for decades, It belongs to We The People, but the city has placed signs upon it in what appears to be an effort to Steal It from Us. They have placed signs upon the park which insinuate that we will be prosecuted for using it for it’s intended purpose; a campground. Could this be the city’s attempt at adverse possession? If no objections are made by Us, We The People, then that adverse possession may have some legal standing.
But are you reading this?
I am verbally objecting on the grounds that the Martin Branch Trail spur of the Sheltowee Trace National Recreation Trail is accessible most logically by traveling through Our Rodburn Hollow Recreation Area, and any sign denying Our access to said trails during any hour of the day or night is a violation of Our Constitutional Right To Travel.
I do have other reasonable objections as are evidenced within this and other writings.which have been published upon this Community Forum.
May 30th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Here is a weekend activity if you get board…
Click on the map above for a larger version and print it out.
Then drive out to Rodburn Hollow Recreation Area and see
if you can tell what is still there and what is missing.
Note the differences on your map.
Also be sure and note any improvements on your map.
Bridges across Martin Branch might make for a good example.
12 missing 2 lamp posts at the campsites might make for a good example as well.
If you have a digital camera and some time, you might want to
take some pictures before & after of litter laying around…
(Yes, I’m suggesting that everyone pitch in and clean it up some).
I have noticed that these articles on Rodburn Park has had some impact
as I encountered only one downed tree about half way on the Loop Trail.
(and it looks like it has been there for a while)
I noticed that at least one tree has been removed (fresh looking cuts) from
across the trail recently (near the Sheltowee/Martin Branch Trail sign).
So the other side of the creek isn’t quite as bad as what I had expected
after hearing people complain for a few years.
The spur leading to the main Sheltowee Trace doesn’t look so promising or
as well maintained, but the Rodburn Loop Trail is just about totally wheelchair
accessible with the exception of only a couple of places. The sad fact is that
when these places are reached upon the trail, there isn’t quite enough room
to maneuver a wheelchair around in the opposite direction because the
obstacles are upon a high bank/steep slope area.
But print the map out, and spend some time locating both what is and isn’t
still there (some things are either broken or missing altogether).
Just my suggestion for some weekend family fun without having to burn a
tank of gas driving to the lake. Use it or loose it? Seems to be Our choice.
May 30th, 2008 at 3:32 pm
I suspect the city has those signs mainly to stop makeout team sports
after dark; (Now the thread needs retitled sorry).
I would doubt they could catch me if I decided to hike into the woods or mt. bike up that trail after dark with or without a light, I am not in as good of shape as when I
biked up that with the cross country team a couple of times, all but one turn
with root stair steps, BUT I have a limbo spider with a 19tooth granny gear that spins
my old fat butt up stuff I could not make when I was 21 (at about 3-4mph LOL)
May 30th, 2008 at 3:46 pm
Last I heer-ed there was no back country camping "permit" needed along the sheltowee with the exception of protected areas like the Red River Gorge; you are suppose to camp more than 50feet from a road and 25feet from a trail I THINK? It is some certain number of feet;
SO since the Martin Tolliver Trail is a official USFS spur connector, you should be able to camp along it, if not in the Rodburn CITY park, up the holler somewhere or on the ridge, and the city can say nothing, I would bet USFS land on the other side of the street is fair game even within the City Limits. The backside of Eagle Lake ridge is city limits and there are pleanty of good sites there too, nice trail down to the lake for some water to boil hot dogs or small batches of laundry. IF the cities explode from a economic crash, look for vagabond camps all over the place in such cases. I camped a couple of nights back in the late 1980’s on the Interstate side of the ridge, there are several clear criks back there with a few pools big enough to take a cold bath in, REFREASHING!
May 30th, 2008 at 5:36 pm
No permit is needed for Back Country Camping, the rules are 300 ft from any road, trail, or waterway, and 100 foot away from any Cliff-base or Rock-Shelter. Additionally your campsite shouldn’t be visible from any road or trail, and "Leave No Trace" ethics should be observed.
Camping in caves or rock-shelters is also a no-no according to the USDA/USFS.
(NOTE: The above applies to National Forest Land)
Permit or Fee is only required upon "Improved Campgrounds", and to be honest…
I’m not for sure that the city wouldn’t issue a permit if someone were to inquire about it.
I do hear that the Park’s (Rodburn Hollow Recreation Area) primary income is derived
from "Renting" the Pavilion and play field out to people and groups for about $60.00,
and arrangements are made through the Morehead Parks and Recreation Dept.
So they might be willing to allow people to camp there by permit in advance.
But still this would be of inconvenience to Back Country Hikers/Campers who
would like to camp overnight at Rodburn Park (an improved campsite).
It wouldn’t hurt for the city Police to patrol through the night (they do this anyway),
and notify the Parks and Recreation Dept. of any campers, so a representative
could drive out and collect a reasonable fee of $7 or $8.00 from the campers
each morning. This would cost very little and generate even more revenue to
maintain the park with. All that would need to be done is to place a notice of
camping fees upon the Bulletin board. Of course the lamp posts would need to
be replaced, the rear fountain repaired, and a few grill grates replaced.
I know that I’ve raked the city across the coals a few times, but it does appear
that they are trying to accommodate the people when needs are pointed out.
But it takes more than just a few people to point out these needs / wants to
the city, and this is why I keep pointing current conditions out to others.